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 Post subject: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:33 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2006 11:13 am
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Location: Greece
Kitty

Sorry, this question has more to do with missionary work and Bible translation than whistles, but I know you can help.

I need to buy a new laptop because the current one is too slow for using SIL software. I will be going on a dictionary making course in November and need to get a new machine before then. My problem is that all the laptops that meet the requirements have 64 bit computing. The one I would like to buy has an intel processor. In doing some research on the Internet I have discovered that 64 bit computing can be a big problem because some software or even hardware will not work on it. I have Microsoft Office XP and use programmes such as Adobe Acrobat, AVG anti virus, Real Player, Mozilla Firefox. Do you know if I would be likely to have problems using these?

The operating system is Windows XP professional.

Thank you for any advice.


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 2:13 am 
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Location: Colorado, USA
Hello Susan!

To be honest, I don't really know. But I bet there are enough geeks here to tell you.

So you have software that requires a 64-bit processor? Wow, that must be some program. :shock:

If I were you, I'd go to the support page of the software you definitely want to use (Adobe, RealPlayer, etc.) and ask them about potential problems. As you've discovered, there can be issues.

But do you really have a choice if it's required for the course?

When you get your new laptop, you can name it Zippy. :)

Kitty

_________________
"I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things."
Isaiah 45:7 NIV


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 4:11 am 
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Kitty

I'm afraid I mustn't have explained myself properly as you misunderstood my post. The software does not require a 64 bit processor, in fact I would need a special download before I could use it with 64 bit. I do need more RAM and was also advised to get Windows XP Professional. We have always had Toshiba laptops because they are so reliable, but the only ones that meet all my requirements have a 64 bit processor and I'm afraid that it won't be compatible with some of my software and possibly my printer.

I wanted to know what the implications of buying a 64 bit processor are.


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 7:27 am 
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I doubt you didn't explain yourself well; I think it more likely that since I was reading at 2:00 in the morning, I completely missed what you were talking about. :-s

Ok, so the only laptops that meet all your requirements as far as speed and memory are 64-bit machines, and you suspect compatibility problems with everything else.

Again, I don't really know. I do know that when 64-bit first came out it wasn't compatible with very many operating systems yet. I have ignored the whole thing until now so I don't even know what version of Windows will run on it.

Hopefully some of the forum geeks will see this and be able to offer some direction.

Kitty

_________________
"I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things."
Isaiah 45:7 NIV


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit? updated
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 7:56 am 
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Kittty

Thanks for replying even if you couldn't help. I do hope someone else might have the answer.

However, I need to make myself even clearer. I am considering buying a laptop which has Windows XP Professional but a 64-bit processor. The OS is 32 bit. I misunderstood about compatibility with the SIL software as that is only an issue with XP 64-bit. However, I think there can be compatibility issues between a 64-bit processor and some software and hardware.

If anyone knows whether or not I might have problems I would be very happy to hear.


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 10:14 am 
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I do suspect you will have problems trying to run a 32-bit OS on a 64-bit machine, but I don't really know for sure.

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"I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things."
Isaiah 45:7 NIV


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:10 pm 
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I don't know exactly what you're looking for, but you can try Lenovo - I got my daughters computer there over the summer and was able to 'build' what I wanted, rather than just get what's already assembled. And the price was pretty reasonable as well.

http://shop.lenovo.com/us/landing_pages ... 2466382951

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Behold, as for the proud one, His soul is not right within him; But the righteous will live by his faith.
Habbakuk 2:4


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 7:49 pm 
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Susan, definitely not a computer geek here -- (OH, boy, NOT!! :laughing: ) -- but my HP laptop has Windows XP Professional and has an Intel Celeron M processor 1.30GHz, 736 MB RAM. If you're buying a new computer, you may have problems getting XP. Most of the PC computers here in the states seem to require Vista instead of XP. I think there might be a bit of confusion on what Microsoft means by the 64-bit on the XP pro. I don't think it applies to the computer processor but something in the program itself. (I'm probably wrong ... refer back to "not a geek") My reasoning is only that I have the XP 64-bit pro on a computer with an Intel processor, according to my system information page.


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2008 11:21 am 
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Thank you everyone for your replies. I discovered that the centre where I will do my course has an IT department and I contacted them. They said that there should be no compatibility issues with the processor and any software or hardware because the operating system is 32 bit.


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:32 pm 
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Sorry to come in late - been a bit busy lately.

One of our computers at home has a 64 bit processor but it's happily running a 32 bit version of the operating system (XP). No problems with all the various software we run on that one.

It's only if you need to use more than about 3.5 gigabytes of RAM that you need to use a 64 bit operating system. It's all to do with how much RAM the operating system "sees". A 32 bit operating system can only "see" about 3.5 gigbytes even if you've got more installed.

Shalom,
Ian

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"Remember He is divine, and you are de branch" - Keith Green


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:09 am 
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Hey Susan,

Look what just came in my mailbox. This if from a monthly geek newsletter and it's about 64-bit Vista. Good think you're not planning on using that.

Bugs and lack of apps plague 64-bit users
By Stuart J. Johnston

Vista boosters say that the 64-bit edition of the operating system runs applications faster and can address a lot more system memory than its 32-bit counterpart.

Just don't tell that to Vince Heiker, a retired IT executive in the Dallas area who has used 64-bit Vista for some time — and hates the OS.

All versions of Vista have serious compatibility glitches, including problems with Office 2007, but the 64-bit release also suffers from a lack of applications written to take advantage of that version's ability to address more than 4GB of RAM.

In fact, Heiker and several other Windows Secrets readers begged to differ with my Sept. 25 story, which discussed the transition of desktop computing to 64-bit hardware and software.

"Plain, simple, and clear: Vista-64 is junkware. It is absolutely the worst, the buggiest software Microsoft has ever released," Heiker tells Windows Secrets.

What's worse, he said, is that Microsoft has no fixes for the vast majority of Vista's problems.

Early adopters vent their Vista-64 frustration

Many potential users of the 64-bit version of Vista are reluctant to make any OS changes after getting burned previously by 32-bit Vista.

"We're not using 64-bit Vista due to all the problems we've had with 32-bit Vista," says J.C. Warren, a systems engineer at a Seattle-based asset-management company.

Other users' complaints include what they view as important software that doesn't run under 64-bit Vista.

"ACT, a fairly popular contact-management program, will not work in 64-bit, and currently Sage has no plans to support it," reader Frank Boecherer said in an e-mail.

Also on the list of software that readers say is missing in action is a 64-bit version of Adobe's popular Flash player. And don't forget Office 2007, which comes only in a 32-bit edition.

To be sure, many 32-bit applications that were not written specifically to run on Vista-64 will in fact run on that OS. Microsoft maintains a listing of applications and hardware that are "compatible" with Vista, including 64-bit Vista. This listing consists primarily of 32-bit programs that Vista-64 runs in a 32-bit window.

Many 32-bit Microsoft apps, including Office 2007, are listed as working with 64-bit Windows, but some readers who run Vista-64 complain that bugs and incompatibilities abound. In addition, many popular third-party applications, such as Yahoo Music Jukebox Plus, are labeled with a big red "X," meaning they have problems with 64-bit Vista.

Heiker's list of Vista-64 bugs and application incompatibilities is a long one.

Among the problems Heiker cites is "a jerky mouse cursor" that interprets mouse clicks in one spot on the screen as an action on a different spot.

That's not OK, particularly if you're a day trader like those Heiker supports for TradeStation.com, where a click on the wrong spot can cost serious money. Heiker says he's experienced the mouse-location problem with three different mice, all relatively new purchases.

Heiker finally isolated the cause: the 64-bit version of Vista Ultimate failed to remove old device drivers. He discussed the problem with Microsoft support staff, but he says they could provide no solution. Heiker finally resorted to his time-tested standby.

"The only way to get rid of the hardware drivers was to reinstall Vista," Heiker said.

A second problem Heiker points out involves Outlook 2007, which fails to shut down properly. Other Outlook 2007 problems include unexplained freezes and the mysterious disappearance of the preview pane.

Did you say 'millions' of Registry entries?

Another glitch Heiker continues to confront is a real doozy: with no explanation in sight, his 64-bit Vista PC has accumulated some 23 million Registry entries. No, that's not a typo — 23 million.

"I brought this to Microsoft's attention and there's no solution to it," he said. "Apparently, a Registry entry is made each time a 32-bit application tries to update the Vista-64 Registry ... duplicating Registry entries a huge number of times."

Despite Heiker's long list of complaints and multiple contacts with Microsoft support, little has changed. "They haven't fixed a single problem that I've reported," he adds.

Complaints such as those of early Vista-64 users don't bode well for the OS in general or 64-bit editions specifically. Still, 64-bit PCs are in the cards for many current Windows users a year or two down the road. By then, the smattering of 64-bit PCs now appearing on the market will likely become a groundswell.

Today, there are 64-bit editions of both Windows XP and Vista — and there will also be 64-bit editions of Windows 7 when it ships in 2009 or 2010. The question is: When 64-bit computers become the norm for desktops, will all the software pieces be in place?

Many people are waiting for Windows 7's debut

It's looking more and more likely that 64-bit desktop computing won't go mainstream until long after Windows 7 ships.

Unfortunately, there's no information on how well 64-bit Vista is doing in the marketplace. The overall figures for Vista are less than stellar: Microsoft claims it has sold 180 million licenses for all versions of Vista, but take that number with a grain of salt — or perhaps the whole shaker.

Many of those licenses can be deployed as either Vista or XP; analysts state that many of these "Vista" licenses are actually being used for XP.

In fact, according to a Gartner report issued last spring, fewer than 1% of PCs in the U.S. and Europe were running Vista by the end of 2007 — a full year into Vista's lifecycle. Compare that figure with the 80% that, according to the report, are running XP.

Confirming the molasses-in-January adoption rate of Vista is the Gartner study's finding that 55% of European companies and 40% of U.S. firms aren't planning to begin serious Vista deployments (whether the 32- or 64-bit edition) until the first quarter of 2009 or later.

That's awfully close to Microsoft's planned delivery date for Windows 7, which is expected to be significantly faster and more svelte than Vista. Indeed, a Sept. 12 report by Andy Patrizio of Internet News.com states that Microsoft is shooting to ship Windows 7 in time for the 2009 holiday season.

Microsoft wouldn't comment on when it will release a 64-bit version of Office, although analysts predict the next major Office release — code-named "Office 14" — will ship in late 2009 or early 2010. That puts it on a similar track to Windows 7.

Microsoft's impending delivery of Windows 7 and Office 14 could further undercut Vista's viability in the marketplace.

Reader Roger Shuttleworth summed it up in an e-mail:

* "For me, and I suspect for many readers, the major question is not 'Do I want this hardware, increased speed, yadda yadda?' It's 'Will my existing software run on Vista-64, or will I have to fork out huge amounts of cash for new editions?'

"If the answer is, 'Yes, I will have to buy all new software,' then I'm sticking with XP until my machine dies and I can't find something else to run it."

The uncertainty of Microsoft's plans has left more than a few Windows users waiting for the other shoe to drop.

"I've been involved with OS migrations since Windows 95. None of them was as difficult as Vista to deal with," Warren said. "I can't wait to get my hands on an early beta version of Windows 7."

_________________
"I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things."
Isaiah 45:7 NIV


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 Post subject: Re: 64 bit?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:56 am 
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normally what they mean is the computer is CAPABLE of 64 bit processing. but if you install th 32 bit OS you should be fine as the machine will be running at 32 bit. i am running VISTA 32 bit at home. I could run 64 but most programs are not really using that yet. there will come a time probably within the next 5 years though where we will move to 64 or more bit processing.

sigh I wish though that computer makers would stop concentrating on CPU...and start looking...really looking at getting BUS speed up to near the CPU speeds. Then you would see a huge performance gain as the machine could take the info as fast as the CPU could give it to you hehe. But your average computer user doesn't understand bus speed numbers. they just want big CPU numbers. Which is why AMD's naming scheme is so dang confusing for a lot of folks.


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